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Contemplating My Water

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  • #1

    Contemplating My Water

    I have been thinking about my tap water. I have been aging it for 24 hours prior to adding because of all the gases in it straight from the tap (or rather, the filtration system). I am wondering if I should experiment to see if it really takes that long for it to gas off or if that is even the real problem. The pH is 6.6 out of the tap and about 7.6 in my tank. So maybe that is more of a problem than the gas? Sure, after I have been aging it I have not had the fish die like they did when I didn't age it, but I would just like it if I didn't have to.

    Kind of just thinking out loud here.
    Tags: fish, gas bubble disease, tanks, tap water aging, water change
  • #2
    Re: Contemplating My Water

    I wonder how you would test it without endangering the fish though? For example, 24 hours is good, so try 20 hours, 16 hours, 12 hours, 8 hours, woops fish don't look like they're doing well, 8 hours isn't enough. SeewhatImean? (It's one word ) Unless it turns out it is just the pH, then you could measure the pH every few hours and see how long it took to rise. I don't know if there is a quantitative way to measure the gassyness though

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    • #3
      Re: Contemplating My Water

      That's what I was thinking. Maybe I could use one of the danios as the guinea pig?

      Maybe the gas actually goes away quicker than I think. Maybe I can let some sit until bubbles form on the sides, then stir it to remove them and see if anymore form?
      Last edited by Lilibeth_Seasong; 12-11-2013, 09:56 PM.

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      • #4
        Re: Contemplating My Water

        Science!

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        • #5
          Re: Contemplating My Water

          Exactly! I kind of had the feeling you might be the one to help me because of that.

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          • #6
            Re: Contemplating My Water

            I do tend to like science I would do a bunch of different things and document them. Let it sit out, undisturbed, and measure the pH every hour or so. Or, agitate it and see if the bubbles dissipate. Agitation (airstone) would help the pH increase more quickly too It's likely that the bubbles are CO2; lots of bubbles = lots of CO2 = much lower pH. So, by getting rid of the bubbles you'll drop the pH.

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            • #7
              Re: Contemplating My Water

              There is one misconception. The water pH does not change when comparing the straight out of the tap, full of gas readings with that of water that has sat around and gassed off. Those gases affect the test results, not the actual pH of the water itself.

              From your description it sounds like your water is super saturated and causes tons of tiny gas bubbles. This is a very common problem in the winter months as colder water holds more gas. There is a fish ailment known as gas bubble disease as the gas gets picked up by their gills and travels through their veins. And, this bubble can be lethal if it gets lodged in a critical location.

              For me, I fill my tanks slowly, create a waterfall to help release gas and slightly warmer than needed to reduce the volume of gas in the tank. It can take a few hours for it to completely dissipate if I am not careful.

              Anyway, the reason I bring this up is that I am wondering if this is your issue. Not the actual water chemistry.
              - Dena

              All our dreams can come true if we have the courage to pursue them.
              Walt Disney

              The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.
              Socrates

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              • #8
                Re: Contemplating My Water

                Could be, but I have always had this problem. My whole house water system super agitates the water any time of the year. It was July when I lost all those danios the first time.

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                • #9
                  Re: Contemplating My Water

                  Originally posted by catsma_97504 View Post
                  There is one misconception. The water pH does not change when comparing the straight out of the tap, full of gas readings with that of water that has sat around and gassed off. Those gases affect the test results, not the actual pH of the water itself.
                  Hmmm interesting, thanks for clearing that up

                  I'm still confused though; carbon dioxide is acidic, so wouldn't it change the test results?

                  In a biology lab we had water with a sensitive dye in it that turned red in acidic water. Put it in water, no color. Put a straw in the water, blow bubbles, increase the CO2 concentration, water turned red.

                  If there are initially many CO2 bubbles in the water and you take a sample and test it, I imagine the test results would reflect the presence of CO2. If you let it sit overnight and all the bubbles rise to the top and pop and the CO2 is released, the next sample you take shouldn't have as much CO2 in it, so wouldn't the water be more basic/have a higher pH?

                  Pretty sure this counts as on-topic, let me know if it doesn't

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                  • #10
                    Re: Contemplating My Water

                    That's the assumption that everyone makes. It does not matter how much gas is injected into the water. The ph does not change. For example. My tap runs 6.8 in ph. My low tech and non-planted tanks run 7.0-7.2 in ph. And my high tech tank runs below 6.0. All my tanks have the same ph and water chemistry. The difference is the amount of gas trapped in each tank. Plus I do not shock or kill my fish when filling up my high tech tank with my tap water.
                    - Dena

                    All our dreams can come true if we have the courage to pursue them.
                    Walt Disney

                    The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.
                    Socrates

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                    • #11
                      Re: Contemplating My Water

                      Hmmm that is truly bizarre, that the test reads 7.2 vs 7.0 vs 6.0 but the pH isn't actually different? I'll have to look into this more, you've piqued my interest

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                      • #12
                        Re: Contemplating My Water

                        When you were having fish die off prior to aging would you fill with the hose under water or let it cascade down into the tank? I know its a basic thing but I have seen it make a big difference with gas saturated water from a well, your situation may be a bit different though considering the filter is aerating the water somehow.

                        That also makes me think why is your filter aerating the water to such a degree? Does it have some component for this purpose (I have not seen a house filter that does) or is there perhaps air trapped in the unit that needs to be purged?
                        __________________________________________________ _____
                        Try not to be a man of success but a man of value. -Albert Einstein

                        Wise men speak because they have something to say, fools because they have to say something. -Plato

                        Say what you mean and do what you say. -Alot of people
                        110G, 65G, 10, 300G Pond

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                        • #13
                          Re: Contemplating My Water

                          Originally posted by Matt B View Post
                          That also makes me think why is your filter aerating the water to such a degree? Does it have some component for this purpose (I have not seen a house filter that does) or is there perhaps air trapped in the unit that needs to be purged?
                          This! I wondered the same thing, forgot to ask. When my canisters have air trapped in them (like after cleaning them...which I should really do again ), they spit out a bunch of little bubbles.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Contemplating My Water

                            That could be it...

                            Here are some pages on this system -> http://www.ilovemywater.com/fort-mye...eradicator.pdf http://www.clearwatersystems.com/sma...radicator.html

                            Sometimes when you turn on the tap or shower it will sputter and spit out water like there is a lot of air in there. It goes away if you it run for a bit. This happens the most in bathroom closest to where this system is.

                            EDIT: This actually explains the process -> http://ilovemywater.com/uploads/manuals/manual160.pdf Air is used to oxidize the iron.
                            Last edited by Lilibeth_Seasong; 12-12-2013, 10:33 AM.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Contemplating My Water

                              I wonder if there's some central area where you could check for water (I don't know how they work ) like checking the canister; I imagine it'd be impossible to check all the lines. Obviously the air would be wherever the pipes are highest off the ground, but who knows where that may be! I bet Matt would be the one to know how to check

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